2015 Liquid Force Envy

Please make all commercial, shop and industry postings here (no classfied ads!)

Re: 2015 Liquid Force Envy

Postby mxwllms » Tue Dec 16, 2014 10:27 am

the first time i flew the 12m is the only time i didnt use the lowest knots. it was backstalling like crazy and my arms arent long enough to comftorably sheet out enough all the time while riding and the lowest knot does help a little bit but while unhooking i was still needing to pull in the depower strap 8" or so to keep the kite from falling backwards(12m) and that is just enough for the big pull knob to smack you in the face and fingers a bunch. I'm going to add a pigtail to each rear line coming off the kite for extra length and i think that will do the trick. Maybe in steady wind with no lulls the lowest rear line setting will be enough... only time will tell. And i am fully aware that this is just a preference in line lengths and not at all a flaw in the kite itself. it just takes some extra adjusting because its not perfect straight from the box. I guess making it so you fly with the bar out for full power might be a good idea for the arm comfort of those with really long arms but intentionally making your kite prone to backstalling is a bit strange and ive never heard anyone complain about it being uncomftorable to keep the bar pulled in for power, especially since you can just pull down your stopper ball. and people complain about backstalling kites quite a bit
User avatar
mxwllms
 
Posts: 29
Joined: Mon Mar 17, 2014 6:20 pm

Re: 2015 Liquid Force Envy

Postby stringy » Tue Dec 16, 2014 10:51 am

I've had the 2015 9m demo for over a month now but limited to only being about to ride it powered up at rooster rock. kites flies great with fast turning making kiteloops are fun experience.
I think LF did a great job on many things with this kite. I don't even know why they call it an ENVY. nothing like the previous kite.
split strut, direct steering, new bridle, smaller leading edge and max flo. coming from riding parks, I prefer a lighter bar pressure and the envy now has three rear connection points allowing the rider to change steering speed and bar pressure.
pretty fun kite for all levels. will be spending more time on them in LV next week.
Image
User avatar
stringy
There's a Mount for That
 
Posts: 3578
Joined: Tue Sep 18, 2007 4:44 pm

Re: 2015 Liquid Force Envy

Postby mewing5000 » Tue Dec 16, 2014 5:57 pm

In my opinion a BAR should be tuned to eliminate back stalling no matter how it's sheeted. In other words a properly tuned bar should make it inpossibility to over sheet the kite (in the proper wind range).

Just for conversation I'd like to add that I will sometimes de-power my kite just a tad in light wind to help with back stall cause no matter what kite it is it will back stall In light wind when unhooked and riding down wind.

What I'm suggesting is it sounds like a line length issue not a kite performance issue.

Is there any benefit to having the ability to over sheet a kite?
Learn, Love, Live...
User avatar
mewing5000
 
Posts: 377
Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2007 9:28 pm

Re: 2015 Liquid Force Envy

Postby mxwllms » Tue Dec 16, 2014 7:36 pm

thats what i was saying in my last post. its just a potentially annoying adjustment thing, not a design flaw in the kite and if you want to do all of your adjusting at the bar and have a bunch of spare depower rope with a hard plastic knob dangling around, you can. Im just considering a different solution. But depending on what you are doing you can use the ability to oversheet as a tool if you wanted. for example instead of doing a powerstroke with the kite to place it deeper in the window while riding you can actually just pull in the bar and it will stall back a ways then you sheet back out, and there you have it... kite deeper in the window providing more pull. I'm sure there are some other nifty tricks you can use by oversheeting a kite too but i'm not sure. I think at the end of the day it just depends on what you like and what you are trying to do on the water. some people dig it while others do not. and just in case i'm not being clear, in no way am i trying to suggest that there is something wrong with the new envy. Its a great kite, I am just providing a different point of view because while the performance features and flight characteristics may work well for some, its not a great fit for others. and maybe some of these adjustment tips can help someone out who is having trouble adjusting to the charictaristics of these new kites, like me.
User avatar
mxwllms
 
Posts: 29
Joined: Mon Mar 17, 2014 6:20 pm

Re: 2015 Liquid Force Envy

Postby C.J. » Tue Dec 16, 2014 9:13 pm

IMO. there may be some advantage to having a little oversheeting ability when it comes to hooked in big airs. I'm thinking it may help send the kite a little harder due to more steering pull.

just something I've noticed over the years....
User avatar
C.J.
Officer of Bad Ideas, Mayor of Warshentowkneean
 
Posts: 4504
Joined: Thu Dec 18, 2008 10:39 am
Location: Edmonds

Re: 2015 Liquid Force Envy

Postby jason » Wed Dec 17, 2014 8:56 am

I was having a conversation with some people, probably in 2008 or so, about bar tuning and the consensus at the time was to tune it so you had the ability to over sheet. I can't remember why now, maybe you could over sheet a little on a power stroke without back stalling, just adding power, but its something I've not done in years. Ideally I want to be able to unhook and loop my kite without back stalling when slightly under powered.

11 days and I'll be at my official international testing lab.
User avatar
jason
 
Posts: 2400
Joined: Thu Sep 20, 2007 7:25 am

Re: 2015 Liquid Force Envy

Postby jason » Thu Jan 08, 2015 1:09 pm

I was hoping to have more time on the kite in LV but only had one day on it and didn't mess with the settings. There are three line attachment points on the tips that change the bar pressure and turning speed. I'm still on the middle one which is the factory preset, but want to try using the others, slowing the turning speed down for wakestyle or up for waves. I only noticed backstall when the wind was light and I was working the kite, trying to do unhooked loops in low wind, which any kite will do... overall I'm still stoked, but still have only two sessions on it.
User avatar
jason
 
Posts: 2400
Joined: Thu Sep 20, 2007 7:25 am

Previous

Return to Commercial

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests